doodle studs and furnishing genes

[caitlynlovesjesus]

@treesd Specialty breeds? You mean mixed breeds.

There’s nothing wrong with them, but they should be held to the same standard as purebreds… which means health testing and proving the dogs in venues appropriate for the breed or mix. The sport mix people do it, doodle people have no excuse. If their dogs are supposed to be excellent therapy animals, breed dogs that are in therapy organizations and have obedience titles.

 

[treesd]

@caitlynlovesjesus No I mean specialty breeds. You know what will be funny…soon they AKC will begin to recognize them and that will be funny. That will serious grab your onion…when what you call a mixed breed is competing in a competition with one of your dachshunds. LOL!
I’m sorry, but it’s this kind of uppidy and rude attitudes that has ruined ppl’s passions for breeding. That should not be your goal.

 

[caitlynlovesjesus]

@treesd Do you know anything about AKC recognition?

Such as… they literally won’t recognize any breed that’s a cross of two breeds? To protect breeds that are already AKC recognized, FSS will not accept any dogs that result from crossing two AKC-registrable breeds.

Mixed breeds are already allowed to compete in every sport except conformation. There’s nothing stopping them. Other mixed breeds prove their dogs already. Doodlers don’t for some reason, which is unacceptable.

This person’s passion for breeding has shown me they are fine with creating BYBs and have yet to show an example of a reputable doodle mix breeder.

 

[treesd]

@caitlynlovesjesus Yes I know a lot about it and eventually what I’m saying is they’re gonna have to have to start excepting other things like they always do. I don’t believe in a lot of what the AKC does for a lot of reasons good reasons. I think it’s disgusting that they accept line breeding which is in breeding. They also allow now for people to breed dogs with other dogs to get certain colors and then breed it out to then repeat purify the line. Which doesn’t really make it a pure breed does it? I just like how you guys act like you’re all high and mighty and you know everything that there is where you think you do. That everybody else is ignorant what goes on and what happens. I also know that buying an AKC registered dog doesn’t make them perfect either. We’ve spent an extreme amount of money buying AKC registered dogs only to find that they have severe medical issues. I’m sorry but your precious AKC doesn’t mean crap.

 

[caitlynlovesjesus]

@treesd If you knew anything about breeding, you’d know that AKC registered means nothing.

It’s what’s in the pedigree that matters.

Linebreeding can be done ethically. Considering you breed brindle (not purebred) pugs, you must not be proving your dogs.

Where are your dogs’ conformation titles? What about their sport titles? And what about their health testing? Did the dogs you bought have those? If not, you’re buying crap stock.

 

[chrishudges]

@william3 What standard are they being bred to?Does Doodle even have a standard.Why ruin two already great breeds?

 

[turnkeyforex]

@william3 But why not just select for and breed the furnishing gene consistently instead of breeding back to poodles for the F2? It's a gene you can test for, so that's literally a zero-risk strategy and it would, if coordinated across breeders enough generations, result in development of an actual breed that could have standards (including a specific cost) and developed best practices for health.

 

[addie1257]

@william3 I would challenge that it is not unethical to breed two doodles but if you are going to do so you need to know their parental history. The ultimate goal (if you are only using the coat gene for confirmation) is to breed 2 FF doodles. Since it often considered that people are wanting to a doodle for it to be low shedding but have a different temperament than a poodle, constantly breeding back to a poodle would make having mixed the breeds in a first place silly.

Rather an ethical doodle breeder will track the genetic markers present in the parents so they can note what generation and coat type they expect their puppies to have.

I would also argue that there is a lot more that goes into ethically breeding doodles than just coat type. For example desired size, desired temperament, genetics and health factors as well.

As a side point I believe a truly good doodle breeder will work with the existing doodle and cross community to specialize in understanding and building their specific doodle cross to the standards of there community. In other words Labradoodle breeders need to be working with other labradoodle breeders to build the labradoodle “breed standard” and Aussiedoodle breeders need to be doing so with Aussiedoodle breeders. I find it to be a large red flag when a doodle breeder is bereeding many different doodle types. To be a doodle breeder you need to be an expert in the poodle breed, the mixed breed, and your particular doodle breed. This does not leave room to be an expert in multiple types of doodles as a good doodle breeder should already be active in three different dog breed communities, many breeders only ever specialize in one. But that’s my soap box and I will get off it.

 

[william3]

@addie1257 I believe you misunderstood. I dont think it is unethical to breed doodles with improper coats I believe its unethical to sell someone a dog that will have an improper coat when they believe or been informed they will get a curly coat. Yes like I stated in my post if both doodles have FF for furnishing they will have the proper coat that's correct.

You also brought up a good point that doodles do have, breeding back to a poodle will make it more poodle eventually making it in essence a poodle thus is usually seen in micro mini doodles as it has to be generation 3+ this is also why most doodle breeders only breed to 75% poodle.

I did not want to go into all of the ethics of doodle breeding as you mentioned size color etc... mainly I wanted to adress the coat as I have found an influx of doodle studs and hobby breeders even professionals not knowing anything about improper coats or genetics, resulting in unhappy customers or breeders misleading customers which I feel is inappropriate.

You are very correct it is important to research the breed of any kinds genetics to make sure you are providing a healthy dog. I use the generalized term doodle when referring to my girls/ pups online as a generalization we currently specialize in one mix.

 

[mygisfy]

@william3 This is the problem with doodles, and why they'll never be able to stand out as a new breed of dog. Instead of reaching to attain a doodle with two copies of the furnishing gene, breeders cross in poodles because it's easier. Every breed has undesirable traits, or faults, that are bred away from. The difference is, they don't outcross to other breeds to do so.