It’s 6am. I’m terrified of what the night will bring

[theincrediblebaptistor]

I have a 12 week old Bernedoodle who is definitely a little bit of a Velcro dog. We’ve had him for 4 weeks and I work from home.

He hates the crate during the day but has usually been able to settle himself at night. The first night we had him he cried for about an hour. The second night 30 minutes. And since then he might whine for 5 or 10 minutes, but then he settles and better yet, stays that way all night, 1030pm until ~6.

Last night was awful. For context, he got his second round of vaccinations two days ago and yesterday started a three day dewormer course. I put him in the crate at 1030 like I always do and he cried. And howled. And cried. For two and a half hours. I came downstairs to take home out twice thinking maybe his stomach hurt and both times he just wanted to play tug on the leash in the backyard.

Finally after two and a half hours, I caved (my wife made me) and came downstairs. I tried to soothe him from outside the crate to no avail. I took him out of the crate to see if I could get him to settle and it took a while but he fell asleep on the floor. And I spent the night in and out of sleep on the couch next to him.

I know the rule of thumb is to stay strong and do whatever you can to keep him in the crate. How screwed am I? Am I up against another tantrum tonight and every night hereafter? What can I do? I feel awful that he was that upset last night. And I feel awful that I might’ve just messed up what was a pretty lucky situation.

 

[jonowebb]

@theincrediblebaptistor Is it an option to put the crate in your room, next to your bed? Even if you don’t want that long term you could slowly move crate over the next weeks away from you.
It’s pretty harsh to pick up a pup and stick it into a new environment then stick pup into crate alone, downstairs and let pup howl for an hour.

 

[theincrediblebaptistor]

@jonowebb For sure it’s an option. The reason why I’m here posting is because I want to do right by my pup.

And totally hear you on the harshness. For the first two weeks, my wife and I did sleep downstairs with him and it’s only when he was comfortable did we do back upstairs. And he was fine for another two weeks, until last night. Our breeder told us “shut the door and let him work through it” and that was never our style. I’m just worried about making the right move for him.

 

[randomperson123]

@theincrediblebaptistor Former breeder here - that’s not how you crate train a puppy. Crate is near you, blanket, toys, water in crate. Coax them in, never punish them with crate time. It should be their secure happy place.

 

[joseywales1978]

@theincrediblebaptistor Puppy is probably freaked out that it’s alone, put the crate in the room where you are for now at least

 

[jonowebb]

@theincrediblebaptistor There’s a lot of info on the sub on why letting a pup “cry it out” isn’t recommended
Honestly, you can take things slow with a pup and they develop fast. Better a bit too slow then way too fast.
I had pup in a crate on my nightstand for 3 months and now she’s fine on the floor on the other side of the room.
We could work on outside of the room now but we won’t as we always like dogs in the bedroom with us.

 

[gb1985]

@jonowebb Tbh even for human babies letting them cry it out isn’t good! For any living thing, human or otherwise, often crying is one of the only ways they can communicate to us that they need something. If the need is just attention, it’s not usually a very strong need to them, more of a want, and they’ll calm down pretty quickly. If they don’t calm down within like 10-30 mins, usually there’s another need not being met as well. That’s my experience anyways

 

[johnybelievesinchrist]

@theincrediblebaptistor Sounds like you ripped the bandaid off too fast. I gradually moved farther and farther. I had the crate in my room. Then every night moved it 1 foot farther away. After 2 weeks, it was in the hallway. Then (unknowingly) made the downstairs crate more comfortable than her bedroom crate. She stopped coming upstairs on her own.

So 1, do it gradually. 2, see if the comfortable thing works, I dunno about that one

 

[imagebeastmarkbeast]

@theincrediblebaptistor My dog trainer aunt would tell you to crate the dog in your bedroom at night.

 

[davis32123]

@theincrediblebaptistor I would go back to the beginning, i.e. sleeping downstairs and comforting him. I think puppies sometimes "regress" and you might just need to reinforce the behaviour again. I wouldn't be overly concerned though if he was fine for 2 weeks, and in this case it might just be the vaccination.

I personally wouldn't let them keep crying for an extended period of time - I think up to 20min is fine but longer than that it's difficult for the puppy to actually settle at all.

 

[theincrediblebaptistor]

@davis32123 Thank you for this. I just get nervous about reinforcing the behavior that crying + barking = attention. But I agree — a step back to make sure he’s comfortable is definitely necessary.

 

[wright93]

@theincrediblebaptistor If you can keep pup in your room, and then slowly move the crate further and further away, you may well find there is no crying or barking to reinforce. In the early days our puppy’s crate was on an ottoman literally right by my face. If our pup cried or barked, he got a VERY boring trip outside to go to the toilet (on a leash) and then straight back inside with no fuss. It took us a few months to slowly move the crate out of the bedroom but our pup is now confident and happy in the evenings to sleep away from us. I just mention all this because you seem to not want your pup to be uncomfortable or scared, and this is a way to do it and maintain the crate. Our pup also had awful tummy issues so it was helpful to have him close and hear if he needed to go out in the night.

 

[de2105]

@theincrediblebaptistor Is the crate covered at night?

 

[theincrediblebaptistor]

@de2105 Yes crate is covered and tucked in a corner to help him feel safe.

 

[holytweetz]

@theincrediblebaptistor I have two crates for my puppy. One in the living area and one in the bedroom— identical beds and set up. Our little guy likes to be near us!

 

[jonowebb]

@theincrediblebaptistor The key = preventing excessive crying and howling by going at a pace your pup can handle.
All our dogs have done a slight whining with crate training and separation training but never crying or howling and if they did we would take a step back and go slower.

 

[raymac1]

@theincrediblebaptistor my deaf puppy (now a perfect 4 yo lady) was very hard for crate/sleep training. we also initially tried keeping her in another room because the crying was like sleep deprivation torture, but once we moved her into the bedroom (still in her crate) where she could see us and her big sister dog if she woke up, she was fine after a couple nights. now i feel terrible thinking of how much we were asking by making her sleep all alone; they've spent their whole life with a litter! I'm both pro-crate and pro-comfort-your-puppy. the dogs sleep in our room to this day.

it's been a good balance as she's aged too. hasn't given her any dependency issues, aside from the normal shadow-dog tendencies of a deaf mini aussie lol. only downside is she's a morning person

 

[jacquiluvsjesus]

@theincrediblebaptistor I don't know how important the crate is to you, but I gave up pretty early and let my baby berner sleep next to me on her bed in my bed room. She's been very comfy ever since. Puppy proofed my bedroom so that easily became her timeout room as well. Never an accident. It's something you could maybe consider.

 

[theincrediblebaptistor]

@jacquiluvsjesus Thanks for the perspective. The crate is pretty important to us, if only because it gives us a little peace of mind that he’s safe while we can’t have eyes on him. But for sure it’s an option if this continues.

 

[imagebeastmarkbeast]

@theincrediblebaptistor We didn't at 12 weeks, but at around a half year we stopped making our Labradoodle (also a super velcro dog) puppy sleep with us in the bedroom as soon as we were reasonably confident she wouldnt have a potty accident on the sheets. We still put her in the crate when we left the house without her, contractors/delivery people were coming to the house, or any other reason she'd be crated until literally 2 weeks ago (and shes about 1.5 years old now). Even now we still have the crate there if she wants a quiet space to do something (she usually brings her dentasticks there).

So letting them not sleep in the crate doesn't necessarily mean you can still crate train them/use the crate for other stuff.