Does your dog sleep in your bed?
- Thread starter inneed1012
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inneed1012
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@aspiegrace Boundary setting leads to a healthy relationship with your dog in general. It also provides structure and this gives a dog more confidence to know their expectations so their reactions become more predictable and less of an outburst, in some situations. I imagine we don’t see it here but holy crap in our reactive dogs class, the number of owners who have challenging dogs that have absolutely 0 control, 0 boundaries, 0 rules, im always shook. What do you mean your dog is reactive and it doesn’t even know how to sit? What do you mean your dog is reactive and you just use a plain flat collar and let it pull you all over? Jump up on you? There are many more than can be set in the house to provide a sense of safety for a nervous or emotional dog. Boundary setting is very important but not for the reason some people believe, it’s not about being alpha or being in control.
@inneed1012 The great thing is, "boundaries" are a completely made up concept in dog training to denote desirable behaviours for humans, and that looks so different in every single home I have ever worked with.
I prefer to use terms like good guidance, clear communication, reliable handler, as opposed to boundaries - because it's so hard to define for every individual home and handler what "boundaries" actually mean.
There are a lot of things I do (as someone with a reactive dog, and also who is in rescue helping others with reactive placements) that I think people would be equally as judgemental about as you just were in your comment, listing a bunch of arbitrary behaviours that you personally think are important (sit/don't jump/don't pull on leash) but are just not an issue for me or him and so I don't need to micromanage my dog and his ability to offer behaviours which feel natural/fun/nice in his own home.
Providing a safe and enriching environment is important, ensuring any rules that exist within the home are fair and consistent is important, but also agency and choice and autonomy is important.
[Edit, can't spell desirable, whoop]
I prefer to use terms like good guidance, clear communication, reliable handler, as opposed to boundaries - because it's so hard to define for every individual home and handler what "boundaries" actually mean.
There are a lot of things I do (as someone with a reactive dog, and also who is in rescue helping others with reactive placements) that I think people would be equally as judgemental about as you just were in your comment, listing a bunch of arbitrary behaviours that you personally think are important (sit/don't jump/don't pull on leash) but are just not an issue for me or him and so I don't need to micromanage my dog and his ability to offer behaviours which feel natural/fun/nice in his own home.
Providing a safe and enriching environment is important, ensuring any rules that exist within the home are fair and consistent is important, but also agency and choice and autonomy is important.
[Edit, can't spell desirable, whoop]
inneed1012
New member
@booboo222 I’d have to disagree, jumping and leash pulling (without a command/being asked for) aren’t appropriate, it shows the dog lacks impulse control which is a clear example of a lack of boundaries. You are correct, boundaries are different for everybody, each dog and handle is different and have different needs but when you’re working on a dog with behavior issues, impulse control is the first step in any of it. It’s really the first step in basic obedience, you can’t train a dog who doesn’t understand how to control their impulses. We went hiking once and somebody had their off leash dog just running around, it launched itself at me, got my clothes muddy, licked my face, then ran off and I just hear “don’t worry she’s friendly”. Yeah those are her natural urges and it’s fun for her, she’s living her best life, but 10000% not appropriate. I got knocked off balance but didn’t fall but a child would have been knocked over, an older person would have been knocked over. Just because something is “fun” doesn’t mean it’s appropriate or should be allowed.
@inneed1012
Never once did my comment note dogs should be allowed to engage in behaviours which are anti-social or unsafe.
I'd much rather a dog who is curious and confident, an engaged and motivated learner because they are allowed to offer a variety of behaviours and working with me as a handler is fun, than a quote/unquote obedient dog. But some people will place far more importance on a dog who will comply and accept any and all directives given, and that's what is going to work best for their household.
I guess TL;DR - I'm advocating for people ensuring that what they are doing is what is best for them and their dog, and not something that they read somewhere was what they are "supposed" to be doing
Without getting unhelpfully argumentative: "impulse control" is a highly contentious one within the circles of working professionals. Those in sporting spaces will espouse it as foundational training, and those in behaviour mod would prefer we move to the term "emotional regulation" and as usual the science is new and the old school mentality ingrained. Personally I think if you've never worked with high drive or primal breeds that aren't biddable it's exceptionally easy to believe that dogs need to learn "impulse control" by a measure of made up rules. I completely understand obedience class 101 (your dog should sit/wait at doors/wait for food/walk loose leash/etc) but for many of us what actually matters isn't the specific outward behaviours, but influencing decision making, empowering choice, actively working on a compromise between what the dog wants and what is best for our home (noting, as I did in my previous comment, that this coincides always with safety).
Never once did my comment note dogs should be allowed to engage in behaviours which are anti-social or unsafe.
I'd much rather a dog who is curious and confident, an engaged and motivated learner because they are allowed to offer a variety of behaviours and working with me as a handler is fun, than a quote/unquote obedient dog. But some people will place far more importance on a dog who will comply and accept any and all directives given, and that's what is going to work best for their household.
I guess TL;DR - I'm advocating for people ensuring that what they are doing is what is best for them and their dog, and not something that they read somewhere was what they are "supposed" to be doing
Without getting unhelpfully argumentative: "impulse control" is a highly contentious one within the circles of working professionals. Those in sporting spaces will espouse it as foundational training, and those in behaviour mod would prefer we move to the term "emotional regulation" and as usual the science is new and the old school mentality ingrained. Personally I think if you've never worked with high drive or primal breeds that aren't biddable it's exceptionally easy to believe that dogs need to learn "impulse control" by a measure of made up rules. I completely understand obedience class 101 (your dog should sit/wait at doors/wait for food/walk loose leash/etc) but for many of us what actually matters isn't the specific outward behaviours, but influencing decision making, empowering choice, actively working on a compromise between what the dog wants and what is best for our home (noting, as I did in my previous comment, that this coincides always with safety).
@booboo222 100% with you here!!
@inneed1012 Agree! Having good boundaries doesn’t always have to exclude pets on furniture. In some cases it might and maybe ever should.
Per usual, blanket statements don’t win the day.
Per usual, blanket statements don’t win the day.
jkrauser1989
New member
@aspiegrace I was also thinking if he meant resource/location guarding. I can understand not wanting them to guard your bed from you, or bite if you move around under the covers. In that case, you may be enabling the guarding/setting the dog up for failure by allowing them to practice and reinforce the guarding. But a blanket statement with "all dogs..." isn't really appropriate. And I agree case by case needs to be evaluated.
I don't let my reactive dog on the furniture at home, but when staying in a hotel he is able to calm down and relax better when sleeping on top of the covers with some body contact (paw touch, back, butt in my face, etc).
I don't let my reactive dog on the furniture at home, but when staying in a hotel he is able to calm down and relax better when sleeping on top of the covers with some body contact (paw touch, back, butt in my face, etc).
@inneed1012 I agree that rigid blanket terms and rules are often unhelpful. I wish these people could understand that what works with one family and their animal(s) may not work for another. I have a now 8 year old rescue that hubs and I adopted at 2. He was not leash or house trained, extremely nervous and boy has it been a challenge to bring down his reactivity. For us, having him on the bed turns him into a self righteous little shit who simply refuses to do what he is routinely told, like sitting to put leashes on etc. When we put boundaries down on where he sleeps, he is much more interested in listening and so much calmer. However, I have slept with wonderful dogs in the past and it made them want to listen more and improved our relationship. Now, I love my boy and he has taught me so much, and as I said earlier, what works for one may not work for another. I think it is important for people with power and influence to remember that, lest they set people up for undue expectations and subsequent frustration.
@youngwife My parents have a Golden Retriever and a Bernese Mountain Dog who are absolutely never allowed on the furniture. I have an Amstaff who is allowed on all my furniture including the bed, and she never gets on the furniture at my parents’ house even though we spend a fair amount of time there. Dogs are a lot smarter than we give them credit for!
coachboone73
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@imagebeastmarkbeast No sleeping in bed. Walking through grass with dog urine and feces and who knows what else in it, not gonna happen.
pixeloriousspriteson
New member
@coachboone73 I want to care about this and thought I would, just like her licking my face. Turns out I don’t care. And still agree it’s gross! 
Luckily she doesn’t want to sleep under the covers, and she eventually jumps off the bed once we’ve tested her patience too many times by moving.
Luckily she doesn’t want to sleep under the covers, and she eventually jumps off the bed once we’ve tested her patience too many times by moving.@pixeloriousspriteson Same with my pup! She wants to be nearby, but she much prefers having her own bed on top of my mattress, versus being under the covers with me
@inneed1012 Sounds like you’re fine. You said yourself your dogs know their boundaries and listen. Why shouldn’t they get the most comfortable spot if everyone’s happy?
inneed1012
New member
@ccampbell I don’t feel like we have a boundary problem but part of progress is always learning, being open minded, taking in new info so I’m making sure I’m not missing something.
@inneed1012 That advice is rooted in "alpha" mentality. Yes, there are times when access to furniture should be restricted as a management strategy. Not because disallowing them into those spaces will somehow fix the root of behavioral issues, but because if your dog resource guards those spaces the first step is to just not give them the chance to guard them in the first place. And obviously if you need your dog to get off when requested, teach that. But the advice that reactive dogs shouldn't be allowed in beds usually goes hand in hand with "eat before your dog" and "exit all doors before your dog", etc. etc. It has no merit.
My reactive dog doesn't typically sleep with me because he gets hot, so he prefers the floor or his own bed. But he's allowed up anytime and often comes up in the morning for cuddles.
My reactive dog doesn't typically sleep with me because he gets hot, so he prefers the floor or his own bed. But he's allowed up anytime and often comes up in the morning for cuddles.
@childman That’s really interesting … we do all those things but not because of alpha mentality. The “eat before” thing was because we were training him to wait calmly/patiently without begging at the table, and so we could take him to cafes eventually. And we make him wait before exiting a door because we were working on his impulse control. Also because he used to be very dog-reactive and we wanted to do sidewalk scans before venturing out. He’s solid now so we’re not as intense about “the rules” but we were pretty strict during his initial training.
We haven’t dealt with the furniture/bed thing because he has never shown interest! Even when I try to get him up on the couch for cuddle time he’s perfectly happy on the carpet.
We haven’t dealt with the furniture/bed thing because he has never shown interest! Even when I try to get him up on the couch for cuddle time he’s perfectly happy on the carpet.