Tried to schedule a behavior vet appointment…they said it’d be $900 for 1 office visit

[mollym8505]

@misschildfree1970 Sorry just now seeing this. So far it’s okay.. hella expensive but our vet Dr. Spano is really nice. The first drug we started our dog on made his reactivity worse, and this second drug hasn’t had an effect and it’s been a little over a month. We have a follow up appointment Monday so I’m going to try to see if we can switch to a third drug. Otherwise If nothing helps him I’d rather have him drug free.

 

[misschildfree1970]

@mollym8505 Thanks for circling back to share!! We have an appt with Dr. Spano, so fingers crossed

 

[breatheme]

@proguarda1 I've heard that getting a dog is, from a financial perspective, comparable to getting & maintaining an additional car. I guess we should try to think of our reactive dogs as luxury vehicles?

All kidding aside, I have often had similar thoughts/feelings/frustrations. I can empathize completely. When my dog first started showing signs of reactivity, I looked into private lessons with the same company we had done our initial, pre-COVID (affordable) group obedience classes with. They started at $250 an hour. And this was for virtual sessions. I was absolutely shocked.

 

[rkj]

@breatheme I wish my dog was as cheap as my car.

 

[floxy4u]

@proguarda1 This sounds exactly like NYC prices - the rates are right for the VB- there are limited VBs and you may need to wait to get an appointment due to demand. The follow-up appointments are virtual and short - like 15-30m and tend to be every 8 weeks or so until you find the right medication. Mine charges this by 15m increments so only charges based on the time needed. Then it's just the in person medical follow-up every 8 mo or so. Yes, super expensive. If you are in NY area - I know there's a VB in NJ that may be different pricing.

BUT you can find a certified behaviorist for less. Sometimes virtual training is less than in person ($150 -170/hour)- but the initial consult is usually 90m which will be a higher price. The benefit of going to the trainers within the VB practice is that they collaborate with the vet on the plan and share notes. The vet's plan is shared with whichever trainer you work with - but the notes/collaboration is not unless something specific.

Here's a link to find a certified behaviorist: https://m.iaabc.org/consultant/

Most have website that show the pricing upfront.

 

[austins3991]

@proguarda1 I paid £500 for a behaviourist highly recommended by the head vet at my practice. 3 appointments, 90 mins and 2x60mins.

She told me the anxiety and reactiveness was because I wasn’t alpha enough. Told me to tether him in the house so he couldn’t get to windows or follow me around, spray him in the face with water on walks, not allowed on the couch, don’t talk to him, don’t let him initiate play, go through doors first and, for walks, use a semi-choke collar. Use that choke collar in training. On a maltipoo who have very delicate tracheas.

I tried…I tried to follow her advice and my dog was so depressed. It also didn’t help at all. Once I’d thought about it I wasn’t happy…she didn’t answer my questions about how to get him to walk without being scared of every noise and didn’t answer any questions about bad separation anxiety. She said he was too dependent on me and needs confidence AND that he thinks he’s the alpha dog, and once I’m more assertive the separation anxiety will fix itself. Didn’t take into account the fact that I said he was nervous from day one…it was all my fault for doing it wrong.

Needless to say I didn’t go back and asked for a refund. I got £100. So I paid £400 for some advice from the 1980s cesar milan shit.

My actual vet was appalled. She said no one believes that stuff works anymore, it’s very outdated and not recommended. She couldn’t believe the choke collar.

It’s a minefield….a very expensive minefield.

 

[wallaceholt]

@austins3991 Maybe you should report that VB to some Vet regulatory body? I'm not in the USA so wouldn't know what that would be. In this day and age it's choosing to be ignorant to be passing that sort of "advice" and you wouldn't want anyone else to suffer at their hands and waist a load of money.

 

[ludovico1138]

@austins3991 I am so sick and tired of hearing about “trainers” and “behaviorists” using choke, prong, and shock collars on small dogs with a predilection to tracheal collapse and redundant membranes. It’s absolutely disgusting and it’s an affront to both the veterinary and training fields. There is very little regulation anywhere in the world I regard to trainers, so you have to be extremely cautious. If they would just pick up a book…! I digress. I don’t want to hijack this thread but if you have an anxious dog, a dog with separation anxiety or believe he is displaying anxiety related behaviors, I can guide you in the direction of credible professionals in your area who are backed and vetted by the top people in the industry where separation anxiety/anxiety is concerned. But honestly it doesn’t really matter where you’re located any anxiety specialist worth a salt will likely want to work remotely with you regardless (for a host of reasons) even if you live right next door. Hearing these stories makes me physically ill and incredibly angry. I’m so sorry you and your pup had to go through this- everything about it is wrong. There is a fine line between trainers as a collective not guaranteeing behaviors for welfare reasons and the simple fact you cannot force another living being to comply without pain and intimidation- and taking peoples money while ruining lives knowing full well they are wholly ill equipped to handle the work and too lazy to maintain continued education as the science evolves because it will hurt your bottom line. It’s so widespread, and dogs don’t have enough time on this planet to be mishandled like this. Rage rant over. Message me if you want a list of names that can help undue the damage whoever that was did.

 

[austins3991]

@ludovico1138 I know…it’s weird because when you’re there in an unfamiliar place, they sound so convincing. Plus between all of that there was some stuff that was more useful and gentle. As soon as I got home I started to question the approach given that I had read a lot about how rubbish the alpha dog crap is, including the discrediting of the studies. I have had dogs before, had already done a lot of research, read books and tried multiple things. I just felt that she really didn’t understand my dog and had made some massive assumptions. But…they’re so highly recommended so you question yourself instead of them.

She was strictly against reward based training, saying that the dog doesn’t respect you that way, they just see you as a treat dispenser and will ‘perform’ but not learn how to behave.

I got the martingale collar, despite massive reservations, but very quickly decided I wasn’t going to use it even with the double ended training lead on a harness too…the Idea being you use the choke function carefully. I don’t understand the logic that you can’t train with treats because the dog isn’t learning to actually behave, but getting the same result through physical harm is ok? Surely that’s just the dog doing what you want out of fear of pain/discomfort rather than actually learning to behave? In any case once over threshold my dog would be damaged before any damn lesson was learned. How will that teach him to trust me…he is scared witless and then injured on top of it? (One of the things that caused his dog reactivity is that he was nipped as a puppy by another dog, out of nowhere. She said because I was with him he didn’t trust me to protect him anymore. But choking him when he’s terrified is going to Instill that missing trust??)

And don’t get me started on 'separation anxiety will fix itself once he’s more confident’. My vet said separation anxiety is one of the hardest problems to fix, especially in cases like ours where I worked so hard with him as a puppy and we got there, only to have it all unravel and regress after prolonged Covid lockdowns. What I tried the first time which eventually worked isn’t working now.

Thankfully I didn’t do my dog any harm to undo because I didn’t do all of the things she said. Sure my dog was calmer but he was just sad. He’s part Maltese, they’re lapdogs. Making him lie across the room from me and having ‘one cuddle a day’ while in training is just cruel imho.

His reactivity is a bit better now thanks in part to a mild anti anxiety medication and also consistently working on it. The separation anxiety…still working on that and so far nothing has worked. I tried counter conditioning with a lickimat and high value treats but he abandons it to scratch at the door even if I’m gone for seconds. I did manage to build up to about 30 seconds but then he started to get anxious even at the indication I might leave…e.g. taking a shower, or getting dressed would cause him to stand staring at me shaking like a leaf. And that’s with the anti anxiety meds!

Luckily he is mostly ok as long as someone he knows is at home…it doesn’t have to be me. I don’t have much of a life but I can at least go grocery shopping at the weekend when the teenagers are home!

 

[mick7777]

@proguarda1 This is comparable to the rates I received for two behaviorists in Los Angeles. Neither would see the dog in person due to COVID. So I decided to skip. Sucks both from a money perspective and from having to go out and take multiple videos and do things without someone witnessing my dog in person