level 4(?) bite, no warning. Need advice please

[scottwilson]

Our 2-3 year old, 90 lb rescue dog bit a visitor "D" last night. D held his hand out in greeting (he did not approach, just held his hand out) and our dog approached, sniffed, and then lunged and bit with no warning, visitor needed 5-6 stitches. The dog has met "D" before and was fine, relaxed and no apparent fear.

Backstory. We got this dog from a rescue last fall. I tried to be clear that we were looking for an easy going, sociable dog. We got a very poorly socialized, fearful dog. He has snapped at multiple people. We've previously managed introductions to new people by telling them to not to approach the dog and just let him take things at his own pace. This has gone okay, and sometimes he warms up to people great and is sociable and relaxed. He has snapped at several men though, usually after he approaches them. He's great with myself and my partner.

Last night, we were expecting two couples over for a BBQ. He has met both couples before and while he's been fearful with one of the men "B" (E.g. has snapped several times), he was okay last night with "B" with a controlled introduction (and high value treats). My partner was outside with the dog, but was not paying attention when the second couple showed up. "B" was outside grilling with the dog observing, my partner was in another part of the yard. "B" warned "D" that dog may be feeling nervous, and as stated, "D" put his hand out and our dog sniffed, lunged, and bit him. "D" left to go get stitches, he needed 5-6.

Obviously we failed in managing this introduction, I thought my partner was paying attention. I don't know what to do, I feel like sending this dog back to the rescue would be horribly traumatic for him but I also don't feel like we can handle a dog with this kind of history. My partner seems to not really think this a huge deal and we'll just kennel him anytime we have people over, but I have serious misgivings. I would just appreciate some additional insight and opinions.

 

[cleoi]

@scottwilson I agree with others about hiring a behaviorist. In the mean time, if the dog trusts you and your husband, you might consider muzzle training. Once he’s comfortable wearing it, have him wear the muzzle when visitors are around to protect everyone involved.

 

[scottwilson]

@cleoi dog definitely trusts us, he's a super sweet, goofy dog around us. But I 100% agree about taking more precautions, whether it's a muzzle or a large dog run outside. My biggest fear all along was having him bite someone so this has been a nightmare

 

[tspidey630]

@scottwilson Highly recommend a basket muzzle for this dog. We have a dog that has no history of biting or trying to bite people and our vet still strongly encouraged us to train him to wear a muzzle because he's huge and has some anxiety and if they get hurt, dogs can lash out and bite. If your dog gets injured, already has a bite history and has never been muzzled, you could be in for a really nasty incident in the future. Plus, it will give you a little peace of mind. If you have people over, you still need to manage the interaction, but it would prevent bites like this where you unfortunately weren't around.

 

[theavner]

@scottwilson Hire a behavioral trainer - look for fear free/r plus/positive reinforcement trainers.

 

[derealized]

@cleoi Came here to say this. Basket muzzle training and a veterinary behaviorist

 

[theavner]

@cleoi This this this!!! We weren’t able to fully train the bites out w our rescue but it was clear he had serious anxiety so we consulted several times with rescue & the vet and put him on prozac finally. We are on month 3 & it’s better. So much better.

One thing behaviorists will tell you is that every snap/bite will kind of rewire their brain a little; also they need about 36 hours to come down from the cortisol from that encounter. That means long safe naps in the crate with enriching activities (licky mat, etc) each day.

 

[nablusstar]

@scottwilson You need professional help with this one. What does your adoption contract say?

 

[scottwilson]

@nablusstar I agree we need help. Our adoption contract says that we should return the dog to the rescue if we can no longer maintain ownership or if the dog isn't working out. My partner thinks this would be a massive trauma for the dog, he was very unhappy and stressed at the rescue. My partner also thinks it would be a disservice to any future adopters as we are not sure if the rescue would fully disclose things to future adopters.

 

[imagebeastmarkbeast]

@scottwilson If you did decide to re-home the dog you could foster it until a new owner is found instead of sending it back

 

[scottwilson]

@imagebeastmarkbeast That would be my preference, I think sending him back to the rescue would just make things worse for him. That was an extremely stressful environment. But he has a bite history now and I feel like it will be very challenging to find him an appropriate home

 

[imagebeastmarkbeast]

@scottwilson Best of luck, whatever you do!

 

[newme20]

@scottwilson If you can afford it, I’d try the behaviorist first. If things don’t improve and you feel he’d be better off with more experienced handlers you can get back to the shelter and ask them to find a new adopter while you continue to foster him. This way you can also talk to the people that come to visit him to see if you think they’d be a good fit for the dog. This is a very heartbreaking and difficult situation, I’m so sorry! Best of luck!

 

[kabob]

@scottwilson I would seriously rethink having a dog like this, and if so, you need help managing his nervousness/reactivity. If the dog bites without any provocative behaviour something is wrong. You could also check out the dog healthwise, so he/she is not in any pain/discomfort.

 

[orphideus]

@kabob Even if you are able to improve the behavior, strongly consider getting the dog accustomed to wearing a basket muzzle. This kind of behavior is difficult/impossible to completely fix, and while you are likely to be able to improve it greatly, another (possibly worse) bite is always on the table.

Basket muzzles allow for panting and drinking water, and with gentle training and incremental desensitization to wearing it, you should be able to get your dog to accept wearing it for long periods without being stressed.

 

[kabob]

@orphideus I fully agree with this! All dogs should be trained to wear a muzzle, you might need it one day.

 

[imogen88]

@kabob I agree. Our boy has one to visit the vet. He is a rescue and fearful of men, he has never bitten but I don't want it to happen if he gets scared. I didn't think we would need it at any other time, but last week he came to me hopping with a thorn right into his pad. He was growling and backing off so I just popped the muzzle on to keep us both safe while I got it out.

 

[scottwilson]

@kabob Thank you for the input, I am going to look into finding a behaviorist and maybe the rescue will let us foster the dog while they look for a more appropriate home? I feel like my partner is not really taking this very seriously and it's making me feel like I'm overreacting. But I feel like this behavior is escalating. He went from snapping when approached by someone to approaching and biting last night. And unfortunately he does not give any warning, he doesn't bark, growl, raise his hackles, or whatever

 

[kabob]

@scottwilson You are not overreacting. Having a dog that has bitten will sadly affect your day to day life with the dog. You will be more on alert, and you will be afraid that it is gonna happen again, and the dog will sense any form of nervousness/insecurity. In the end you HAVE to known what you are dealing with, and if you can put in the extra effort it takes.

I say this having experience with a dog who has bitten, and how it affected us. I put in the extra effort, and we were fine, but I never trusted him 100%. And this was a dog I had from puppyhood, without trauma and an unknown past. He was just nervous/shy/aloof and did NOT like strangers. He sadly passed away, and today I got a gsd with no bite hitstory/nervousness/so forth. And it is less stressful.

Edit: wording.

 

[alsu]

@kabob Can’t stress this enough. You have to adjust a lot of plans seriously around the dog once this happens. You’ll be stressed and anxious about little things like unexpected visitors or trips/long errands. You can’t just have friends watch them if you’re busy, overnight guests become a big logistical issue, can’t just bounce around seeing family with the dog on holidays, you find yourself feeling anxious/aware when you’re trying to make the dog do something it doesn’t want to do, even just going in the crate or coming in from the yard. It is a toll and you feel it constantly, and you think about dealing with it with all the life changes you’ll be facing in the future. We were wanting kids and the dog (who I admit I loved and sadly passed before this became an issue) was a real sticking point because I was much more concerned about him being around our potential child than my partner. A dog with aggression issues takes a lot more effort, a lot more logistics and mental energy, and a lot more responsibility and you’ll never (or at least you should never) feel totally comfortable when anyone else is around the dog.