Stud fees, am I asking for too much?

[leorise34]

Hi, this is my first post in this community but I’d just like some opinions on whether the stud fee I am asking for is appropriate given the circumstances.

So for some details, I and a friend met whilst walking our dogs a couple of years ago and we both have huskies. I have a male who is nearly 2.5 and her female is around 3. Their first litter of 6 was born in this Feb, and a second litter of 6 was born in November. My friend doesn’t intend to breed her female anymore after this.

Each puppy from the feb litter sold in April for £800, and my friend offered me £1000 as part of my cut which I accepted. This figure was calculated by the cost of one puppy, plus the fact that I helped sell the puppies as well as dog sit her dog and puppies on more than one occasion, for example when they were moving house. I guess no formal agreement in writing was made as we have a casual friendship that extends beyond just breeding our dogs together, but in hindsight if I ever stud my dog again a formal contract will be written up.

For the most recent litter born in November, each puppy sold for £1500. This is nearly double the price of a puppy from the first litter, however we dropped the price of the first litter to 800 due to worry about the pandemic/national lockdowns meaning people wouldn’t be looking to buy/be able to pick up a puppy.

My friend suggested my cut for the November litter being the price of one puppy, and I have gone back and asked if a cut of £2000 is fair. My reasoning is that my cut last time was £1000 and we doubled the price of the puppies this time, I helped sell the puppies again and until I stepped in my friend was struggling to generate interest from serious buyers, and in the end 3/6 puppies were sold by me/my ads which the owner of the stud doesn’t normally help with.

I’m happy to accept £1500 but given my involvement in the selling and that I was offered more than the cost of one puppy last time, I thought it may be worth asking for more. Any opinions? I know our relationship is not as conventional as two breeders only coming together to breed but would just like to know if I’m out of line here. Thanks!

(Just for info, we are not formal breeders but my friends father is and she grew up around this so she has experience in birthing and raising newborn puppies. Each buyer was thoroughly vetted and no puppies have ever been sold to first time dog owners due to huskies not being a good choice for novice handlers.)

 

[lyndsey]

@leorise34 What health testing and titles does your stud dog have that determines the price

 

[dukedesu]

@leorise34 If this is a friend to friend agreement you need to just come up with something there; I think you probably got a lot for what you offered. As far as what is conventional, it varies wildly from breed to breed as far as what an acceptable stud fee is (lots of factors go into this such as the size of litters that is typical of the breed). To be quite frank, I wouldn't charge more than $1500 -- ~£1000 in my breed for a multiple group placing/group winning GCH dog with full health testing in my breed. Typically the stud fee in my breed is equivalent to the price of one puppy sold, but there's no hard and fast rule. Dogs who have accomplished a lot in their careers often charge more. I've never inquired for a dog with no health testing because I would never use them. I haven't ever inquired about an untitled dog, but I would expect to pay less for a dog who hasn't done anything noteworthy. I hope that if you haven't done the breed recommended health testing, that you pursue this before studding him out further to avoid unintentionally making a negative impact on the breed's health.

 

[leorise34]

@dukedesu Hi, my male had a check up not long before we began breeding which covered the breed recommended health testing in the link provided and was very positive, but thank you I will save this info for if in the future I ever decide to stud my dog again.

I know I’m getting at least the cost of one puppy which is fair, I guess I just wanted to know if I would be out of line for asking for more as I was given more than the cost of a puppy last time and was involved in the selling which the stud owner doesn’t normally do. I may ask to meet in the middle but will happily accept 1500 if my friend strongly disagrees that my input is worth any more than that.

 

[dukedesu]

@leorise34 That depends on the arrangement between you and your friend -- most bitch owners will not ask for help with that. I have worked as a team with bitch owners and stud dog owners to help find good homes for nothing other than to place puppies in the best homes available, but then I also chair our national breeder referral and help place puppies of our breed for breedings I have no part in for nothing more than trying to put the best interest of the breed in mind, so I may be a little skewed in that matter.

 

[leorise34]

@dukedesu Unfortunately as we are friends and not just two breeders working together to breed, a formal agreement wasn’t made but I will definitely be making them in writing moving forward if I ever stud again. Being friends has it’s benefits but has resulted in this grey area!

Thanks for your perspective, to my knowledge the stud owner isn’t usually involved in the selling either but I was actively asked to help sell the puppies as my friend was struggling (vetting potential buyers to ensure they go to good homes was an expectation that came with that of course haha) and sold 3/6, which by the looks of it might still not have been sold after 8 weeks old if I hadn’t. I’ll have a talk with my friend about my input but won’t be too pushy!

 

[dukedesu]

@leorise34 That would definitely be something to do if you want some kind of cut of doing that work. I have always taken that as part of my natural responsibility, but my breed club's code of ethics includes "Breeders, whether owner of the stud dog or brood bitch, have equal responsibilities in insuring the welfare of all puppies and remain responsible for those Salukis throughout their entire lifetime." Breed culture varies a lot between breeds though. I haven't drawn up a formal stud contract either because I have worked with people closer to me typically though that is something I need to do as well.