Periodic velociraptor taming strategies

S

siyanda1978

New member
Clarifications: Australian Shepherd, not an Australian cattle dog (ACD and AS are different breeds). And while I'm sure he has many breed characteristics, his current dominant characteristic is being a puppy.

Lots of robust debate here. I'll say the main issue is those moments without a tool to interrupt the crazy (treat, water, leash) that are overwhelming and painful.

He loves water, no real concerns today squirting him when he's crazy is going to break that affinity. The spirit is strong in this one.

Original post:

We have a 6 month old Aussie. Brilliant, sweet, responsive to training 97% if the time. The other 3% of the time he is a vicious velociraptor. I don't just mean he gets mouthy, I mean jumping, biting, growling. I need a strategy.

We think this mostly happens when he's over tired so we are showing play periods. He is a high energy needs dog, so he gets 2-3 walks totally 4-5 miles + training sessions (*3/day) + wrestling with our old dog + general play (including new skill: fetch).

He generally is:
Up: 5:30-8/9am
Crate napping: 9-12
Up: 1-4pm
Crate napping: 4-5pm
Up: 5-7:30
Napping/milling about 7:30-9pm
Crate: 9pm - 5:30am (with potty break sometime in there)

We've tried a number of approaches:
1) Turn back and ignore
2) Firm "NO!"
3) Squirt bottle
4) Crouch down and hold him firmly until he calms.
5)Assert dominance by pinning him to the ground until he calms.

The water bottle method is most effective, but if he goes bezerk when you aren't armed: ripped clothes and bruised arms.

I know it'll be best to pick one strategy and stick to it, but every time I don't have the water bottle in me and he attacks, I feel completely desperate.

Please share advice/experience to help me figure out the right strategy.
 
@siyanda1978 I'd say firstly your pup may need more sleep. Even at 6 months pups need minimum 18 hours. From the structure you've written I'm counting 12ish hours? As soon as the pup becomes a biting machine it's sleep time for me.

Secondly, 2-3 walks a day will only hype him up more and more. The more exercise you do to tire him, the more you'll need to do over time because the threshold has increased, which becomes a losing battle especially with high energy dogs. Aussie's (presume Aussie cattle dog) are true working breeds so they will outlast anyone. Breed fulfillment is your best friend, difficult in all honestly unless you have livestock! Fetch not so much because it's retrieving and less natural to a herder. If you can get a flirt pole to attach a toy to and make him chase and bite the toy, that is more fulfilling!

Thirdly, I'd get away from the squirting water method. There's a chance he begins to react badly to it and then water = bad. Things like bathing then might potentially become a problem!

Fourth, is it possible he's teething? If so then something like a frozen kong will help his gums
 
@soteriologist He has interest and affinity for fetching and none (so far) in a herding ball.

We're fine with a high exercise need, we're hoping for an eventual running companion.

He's definitely still getting his adult teeth! We've lots of teething options. Thanks!
 
@soteriologist Aussies are not a working breed. There’s some working lines out there, but very few and very far in between.

They have high energy compared to what most people are used to - but there viability for work is horrendously overstated. It’s just a fun, disingenuous talking point propagated by unethical breeders and organizations like the AKC.

Maybe off topic, but I feel like more people should know this. I get clients all the time that are disappointed their dog is not a competent herding breed, unlike what they were told.

Edit: my second comment today immediately downvoted by people who don’t know what they’re talking about. I don’t understand the people on this app.

Second edit: I’m not even gonna bother responding to people. You’re all too difficult. These delusions are a disservice to the breed and the people who buy them expecting to get a sheepdog. Yes they have herding instinct, and the AKC even entertains it with their dinky, pretend herding courses. But they generally suck at it. And yes, there is always exceptions. I promise your dog isn’t one of them though.

I have nothing against the breed. Just people who aren’t honest about their purpose/capabilities. I’d love for them to be good at it. They just aren’t. I’ve worked hundreds.
 
@scotty2014 Tbh "it's a working breed" is least objectionable part of that comment.

Assuming aussie means a cattle dog?

2 or 3 half hour walks are too much? Will "hype him up more?"

Herding breeds don't like fetch? (But do like to chase and catch a bite a toy because a flirt pole is ok?)

The least intrusive effective correction is a bad idea because of random assumptions?

Jumping, biting, and growling is because of teething? (Frozen kong will solve everything!)

Ca you imagine actually following this advice? It's disappointing to see this kind of thing here. Maybe it sounds plausible if you've never had a dog like OP's, or you don't think about it too hard? I really don't know.
 
@clintpauljohnson I guess I'll explain my comment as I seemed to have annoyed you.

My assumption was the breed "Australian Cattle Dog", or red/blue heelers (I'm in the UK so that's what I go to, we rarely see Aussie Shepherds) of which my experience has been handling those dogs which have working genetics as told by the owners.

OP didn't say "half hour walks", just 2-3 walks over 4-5 miles. OP has since said they want more exercise so that's fine by me. In general pets, again in my experience too much exercise creates an athlete of a dog and can prove a bit more difficult for the dog to settle in the home.

I said fetch is not natural to a herding breed because it's not a retriever. That is a fact. Genetically anyway. But again, OP has said the dog likes fetch so that's fine. Herders bite at cow/sheeps heels hence my chase and bite with flirt pole comment. Again because it seems like a pet dog not a working dog, chasing a toy on a flirt pole is another physical/mental outlet for the dog.

Spraying water. Again in my experience, I have come across so many dogs that have been sprayed by a hose or had water poured on them not necessarily out of correction but for human fun, that the dog would refuse to be bathed. Adding to that, if the spraying isn't effective after a couple of attempts, don't carry on because it's pointless.

I didn't say Kongs would sort out biting, growling or jumping. It was a mere suggestion for if the dog is teething, which OP seems to suggest it is. I haven't advised anything on jumping, biting or growling.

I posted this off my own experience, if you're only going to belittle that, at least offer your own tips up for discussion.
 
@clintpauljohnson Aussies aren’t cattle dogs. But everything else I agree. Too funny, I didn’t even really pay attention to read the rest of the comment.

Theres Just so many passionate myths about dogs and dog breeds it makes my brain itch when I see people propagating them.

Reddit is really a cesspool of misinformation.
 
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