We adopted Miles after fostering him for 2 months because we quickly fell in love with him. Shortly after adoption his reactivity started showing up, and now we're at a point where we don't know what to do next. My wife is beyond stressed and mentally exhausted with him whereas I have more patience and want to try more to help him. It's to the point it's taking a toll on our marriage because she feels trapped with never being able to have her family come visit as we're unsure how he is with children, and he occasionally lashes out at our other, older dog Toby. She's up late overthinking about what happens if we have kids, and just generally stressed over how much time, money, and effort we're putting into Miles. She's frustrated because I'm unwilling/unable to give up as I feel like I made a commitment to Miles and I can't bear the thought of him not being here, or worse going back to a shelter which I feel would 100% be a death sentence. Our house consists of Toby a chocolate lab/pit mix that's 9 years old (68lbs) and Miles who is a little over a year old now (65lbs). I work from home so I'm home with both dogs all day long, so neither are crated etc, however Miles is crated overnight. Aside from all you read below Miles is unbelievably goofy, sweet, and loves to cuddle. He demands to be under a blanket when you're on the couch, he loves to be chased through the house and demands affection.
Pictures of Miles (out of chronological order)
Even as I'm uploading the videos below he hears himself and he's by myside hard staring at the screen and whining and fixated.
Where we are and what we've done with Miles. He was an emaciated stray found wandering, we fostered him when he was a couple months old and nothing but skin and bones. We made efforts to take him out to hardware stores, my family's house with other dogs, on walks etc. At one point we had to leave him with my parents while we went out of town to visit the wife's family, during which my sister's dog got irritated with him and lashed out and he ended up with a gash and staples on his head. We often wonder if this was the jumping off point for his reactivity. After this trips out in public were no more, any sign of another dog (read the sound of nails on tiles on the other side of PetSmart) would set him into shrieking and screaming and pulling to try and find the other dog. Miles and Toby are getting along great at this point, they wrestle, they play, they get along. I got this video at the request of this trainer to see what he does when we pass a neighbor out with his dog, this is very very minimal to what it grew into now ( )
As he got in better health and coming out of his shell we enrolled him in a well known and reputable dog trainer's puppy kindergarten with trainer 'H'. Unfortunately being in a room with other dogs proved too much and he spent the entire class shrieking and yelping and wanting to get to the other dogs. H tried to "safely" introduce other calmer dogs by holding them and letting Miles sniff them from behind, but that changed nothing. We ended up having to sit outside during a lot of the classes as it just proved to be too much for Miles. It proved to be too much for my wife who took it personally and died a little/cried every time we were asked to wait outside. H offered to work with us 1-on-1 pro-bono after Puppy K was a failure. We worked with taking him out in public and into local businesses that were dog friendly. He did pretty well meeting strangers in the right setting like tellers at a bank behind a desk, but at times was still unsure/less than confident. H advised we continue to do these outings on our own in between sessions. The second time we took him to the same location to work with him and older man walked past, held out his hand as he passed and said "hi doggie", Miles lunged and nipped him on the hand. It broke the skin enough to draw blood on the man's finger right by the nail. The man was very understanding, I apologized profusely, and thus ended these outings. We stopped having people/family come over to our home as we were scared this would happen again.
H advised us to try her holistic vet she swears by and encourage that as our next step. We reluctantly tried this, and for a while Miles had his own custom blend of essential oils he would have a few drops of on his food, plus some Chinese medicine herbal pills. Neither my wife nor I subscribe to this kind of thing, but we gave it a shot as we were willing to try anything. But as we feared nothing changed and we saw no measurable changes with Miles after a few months and few different oil/herb blends. During this time we were still trying to walk Miles in our neighborhood, but the slightest sound of another dog sent him into full on locked in mode. He goes rigid and stares in the direction of the sound and nothing will break his concentration. Seeing another dog out, even 50-75yds away sends him into pulling, shrieking, screaming in which you have to physically drag him away from the stimuli, which at 55lbs wasn't exactly easy. My wife was having a hard time already here and feeling isolated from her family who live out of town and can't come visit now because of Miles.
We consulted our Vet next and he recommended we try Prozac and talk to a local certified behaviorist trainer. We got Miles on Prozac and had our initial consult with the new trainer 'K' in which she recommended we wait 3 weeks for Prozac to kick in before we start working with Miles. K advised that we stop trying to walk him or take him out in public as all of these were inadvertently "bad reinforcements" as he always got what he wanted as a result of his acting out, the stimuli was removed and he was safe. During this time Miles started noticing deer, squirrels, birds etc in our yard and would lose his mind running from room to room to look out the windows and whining/shrieking until we shut blinds/doors. People coming to the door unexpectedly like UPS etc would send him into a tizzy of jumping on the storm door and shrieking. Dogs or other animals on TV would cause him jump off the couch and stand in front of the TV whining ( )
After the Prozac had 3 weeks to settle in we began working with K's partner 'B' as K was on maternity leave, they have been nothing short of wonderful and we saw great progress. With B's help, we taught Miles 'place' when people came into the home and he got much better at greeting strangers who came into his house. We worked on his manners on leash and in the home and worked on walking him in the dead end with controlled stimuli and short session. He was still struggling to break focus when he locked onto an object and our vet recommended we add amitriptyline along with the Prozac. B started introducing a fake dog at a distance and we reinforced his good choices of acknowledging it and turning back to us to look for a click and a treat. We made a lot of good progress and really helped shape some good behaviors around the home for Miles, we were even able to work on walking him short distances in our neighborhood and being vigilant in looking for surprises and worked on what to do if surprised with another dog/person etc. It's safe to say walking was no longer a relaxing thing as we were constantly on watch for dogs/people/issues but we were able to do walks of .5mi or less. Miles learned to jump the fence when there were Deer in the sideyard ( ) so we had to put him on a run, so he no longer gets energy out in the backayard easily unless we're out there and constantly supervising.
During this time we started running into issues with our other dog Toby. Anytime the trainers came to our home we had to lock Toby away as Miles started seeing Toby's presence around his treat givers as a threat and started lashing out at him. Toby needed to stay locked in a room for 15-20 minutes after a session to let Miles decompress or he would lash out on Toby sniffing around where treats were. Our trainer advised we would work on this as time moves on and with our great success of taking Miles out in the dead end, short walks down our street, people/friends in the home we decided to move to a local park that's not well trafficked. We got 2-3 session at the park, even though there were no/few people there were loud traffic sounds which I think were overwhelming. Miles always seemed on edge, he struggled to do things he used to like making good choices to look away from a fake dog setup 50-75yds away. On one occasion a father and young girl were walking 25-30yds away and Miles locked on to them and shrieked/pulled, we redirected, treated, etc. This really worried my wife that we could never have kids in our home as he reacted to that child like he does dogs other than Toby.
It was at this point he started attacking Toby occasionally. They would be playing and wrestling and it would go too far and Miles would jump him and we would have to intervene and separate them. Miles would see a stimuli outside and make little whining noises. Toby would come to see what the fuss was about and Miles would jump him and lash out (seemingly barrier frustration?). It's now to the point that Toby is on edge around Miles. Regularly Miles will "block" Toby in an area and Toby's hackles go up, both dogs go stiff and we have to intervene and separate. This really bothered my wife and I as we don't want to see Toby harassed in his old age. We started having more tiffs over toys and food (not food in bowls, but hand fed food). We had to remove our toy box and we had to implement a hard no dogs in the kitchen rule, as well as no special snacks treats after Miles lashed out and flipped Toby on his back over being in the kitchen while we were cooking. This has helped and really cut down on the spats, they hang out on the couch together and still play occasionally but Toby is still on edge quite a bit and we still have moments where Miles "blocks" Toby in and they both go stiff. Prior to this we had good luck with leaving Miles out of his crate while we left the house for short trips like the grocery store etc. But at the advice of our trainers we go back to crating as a spat between Miles and Toby while we're not home could be tragic and awful. Any play between them now elicits attention from my wife and I as we keep an eye for subtle signs it's going to turn.
We informed B that this was more important than working with Miles at the park etc as Miles has to get along with Toby and not harass him. At this point our K was coming off maternity leave and is the one who works with dog on dog aggression in the home. K's first visit to our home with B at her side did not go well. We got Miles in place and she got in the door, he ran over to K and was fine at first taking treats from her and then suddenly started jumping up trying to nip at her face and barking. We reconvened outside and speculated that maybe he saw her as a threat to his resource B and her treat pouch. We were about to go out of town for the holidays so Miles had to go to the kennel as Toby went to my parent's house (they have a dog and cats, so Miles can't go there). Our trainers know the kennel owner well and arranged to visit Miles twice while we were out of town to try and introduce K on neutral territory. The first meeting went good, apparently Miles turned away and walked away from K, they took that as his way of saying no, this is too much and ended the session there. The second time, days later, Miles was taking treats from K and offering sits, and downs, and then suddenly changed his mind and started hard staring, barking, lunging from what I was told by the kennel owner. It is worth noting though that prior to his going to the Kennel we were weaning him off amitriptyline so we could get him on gabapentin.
Miles has been on gaba for 4-5 days now and we have seen no change, in fact he seems more hyperactive and has been having bladder accidents in the house again. We have a zoom meeting with B and K on Friday to discuss what happened at the Kennel and next steps.
For at least 2-3 months now my wife has been saying she's done and can't do this anymore with him. But at night when Miles is tired he loves to cuddle on her and she loves on him and forgets his crazy, and she swears it's like an abusive relationship. My wife is beyond over working with him and is ready to re-home him or take him back to the shelter as she is beyond stressed and exhausted. I just can't. The shelter is a kill shelter and he would not present well and I truly feel like it would be a death sentence. Rehoming seems impossible as he would need an exact situation of a single female who has no kids and doesn't regularly have people/kids over, no other pets.
Our vet, our trainers, our family have all told us we have done so much more than most people would and that no one would fault us if we had to throw in the towel. But I feel like I made a commitment to this little guy, but it's also driving a wedge between my wife and I. I would be heartbroken but I could hand him to a good home in the right situation, but I refuse to take him to the shelter, but my wife keeps saying that's the only realistic option and "what are we supposed to do just keep going through forever hoping for the right home to turn up?". I'm still hopeful I can find the right med to work with him. Can anyone offer any support/advice? Any other meds I can try that you've had good luck with? I'm looking for a hail mary.
Edit: Completely forgot to add that we had worked on muzzle training previously but we slacked off when changing directions to focus on other behaviors. We can still get a muzzle on him and he wears it when he goes to the vet. Last vet trip wasn't great, we always call to tell them we're there so they can clear the lobby and ensure no other dogs are present. We made it back to the scales and a vet tech didn't get the memo and brought another dog into the hallway, albeit hidden by a wall. But the sound of the dogs nails on the tile set Miles off into screaming and shrieking. We couldn't get him back down to earth, they couldn't get his weight and I ended up having to carry him to the exam room as he was actively trying to go find that dog. During the exam he seemingly calmed down, but the vet was just palpating his stomach and he changed his mind and started barking and lunging to the point the vet was visibly shaken and keeping well away. They couldn't get any bloodwork done on him due to this. We were luckily able to get him his rabies same DTAP because they sprayed cheese whiz on the floor and we distracted him.
Edit/Update: I have read all of your responses and considered them all. I was going to respond to each one addressing things each of you pointed out but it would appear I cannot. We had a zoom call with our trainers to discuss how things happened at the kennel when they visited Miles last to try and introduce K. They told us that K had been working with Miles for 10+ minutes asking for sit and other commands and offering treats which he was doing and happily taking. Both of them are experienced behaviorists and both said they never say dog attacks are out of the blue, there are always signs and body language. But both said after 10+ minutes of working, without any provocation or forwarding Miles changed his mind and lunged up at K's face and neck. Luckily B had the leash and luckily K was wearing a thick scarf that he got instead of her skin. They explained that they've both been in these situations before and they absolutely do not recommend rehoming him. They danced around it a little, but ultimately behavioral euthanasia was discussed. They both expressed that they love Miles and don't take this lightly but his unpredictability makes him dangerous. They explained that since my wife and I are trying to conceive it's extremely difficult to think Miles could ever be in a home safely with a newborn or any child. There is/was the possibility of an expensive specialist behaviorist vet but there is zero guarantee. As much as I hate to say it, we are very much considering BE.
Pictures of Miles (out of chronological order)
Even as I'm uploading the videos below he hears himself and he's by myside hard staring at the screen and whining and fixated.
Where we are and what we've done with Miles. He was an emaciated stray found wandering, we fostered him when he was a couple months old and nothing but skin and bones. We made efforts to take him out to hardware stores, my family's house with other dogs, on walks etc. At one point we had to leave him with my parents while we went out of town to visit the wife's family, during which my sister's dog got irritated with him and lashed out and he ended up with a gash and staples on his head. We often wonder if this was the jumping off point for his reactivity. After this trips out in public were no more, any sign of another dog (read the sound of nails on tiles on the other side of PetSmart) would set him into shrieking and screaming and pulling to try and find the other dog. Miles and Toby are getting along great at this point, they wrestle, they play, they get along. I got this video at the request of this trainer to see what he does when we pass a neighbor out with his dog, this is very very minimal to what it grew into now ( )
As he got in better health and coming out of his shell we enrolled him in a well known and reputable dog trainer's puppy kindergarten with trainer 'H'. Unfortunately being in a room with other dogs proved too much and he spent the entire class shrieking and yelping and wanting to get to the other dogs. H tried to "safely" introduce other calmer dogs by holding them and letting Miles sniff them from behind, but that changed nothing. We ended up having to sit outside during a lot of the classes as it just proved to be too much for Miles. It proved to be too much for my wife who took it personally and died a little/cried every time we were asked to wait outside. H offered to work with us 1-on-1 pro-bono after Puppy K was a failure. We worked with taking him out in public and into local businesses that were dog friendly. He did pretty well meeting strangers in the right setting like tellers at a bank behind a desk, but at times was still unsure/less than confident. H advised we continue to do these outings on our own in between sessions. The second time we took him to the same location to work with him and older man walked past, held out his hand as he passed and said "hi doggie", Miles lunged and nipped him on the hand. It broke the skin enough to draw blood on the man's finger right by the nail. The man was very understanding, I apologized profusely, and thus ended these outings. We stopped having people/family come over to our home as we were scared this would happen again.
H advised us to try her holistic vet she swears by and encourage that as our next step. We reluctantly tried this, and for a while Miles had his own custom blend of essential oils he would have a few drops of on his food, plus some Chinese medicine herbal pills. Neither my wife nor I subscribe to this kind of thing, but we gave it a shot as we were willing to try anything. But as we feared nothing changed and we saw no measurable changes with Miles after a few months and few different oil/herb blends. During this time we were still trying to walk Miles in our neighborhood, but the slightest sound of another dog sent him into full on locked in mode. He goes rigid and stares in the direction of the sound and nothing will break his concentration. Seeing another dog out, even 50-75yds away sends him into pulling, shrieking, screaming in which you have to physically drag him away from the stimuli, which at 55lbs wasn't exactly easy. My wife was having a hard time already here and feeling isolated from her family who live out of town and can't come visit now because of Miles.
We consulted our Vet next and he recommended we try Prozac and talk to a local certified behaviorist trainer. We got Miles on Prozac and had our initial consult with the new trainer 'K' in which she recommended we wait 3 weeks for Prozac to kick in before we start working with Miles. K advised that we stop trying to walk him or take him out in public as all of these were inadvertently "bad reinforcements" as he always got what he wanted as a result of his acting out, the stimuli was removed and he was safe. During this time Miles started noticing deer, squirrels, birds etc in our yard and would lose his mind running from room to room to look out the windows and whining/shrieking until we shut blinds/doors. People coming to the door unexpectedly like UPS etc would send him into a tizzy of jumping on the storm door and shrieking. Dogs or other animals on TV would cause him jump off the couch and stand in front of the TV whining ( )
After the Prozac had 3 weeks to settle in we began working with K's partner 'B' as K was on maternity leave, they have been nothing short of wonderful and we saw great progress. With B's help, we taught Miles 'place' when people came into the home and he got much better at greeting strangers who came into his house. We worked on his manners on leash and in the home and worked on walking him in the dead end with controlled stimuli and short session. He was still struggling to break focus when he locked onto an object and our vet recommended we add amitriptyline along with the Prozac. B started introducing a fake dog at a distance and we reinforced his good choices of acknowledging it and turning back to us to look for a click and a treat. We made a lot of good progress and really helped shape some good behaviors around the home for Miles, we were even able to work on walking him short distances in our neighborhood and being vigilant in looking for surprises and worked on what to do if surprised with another dog/person etc. It's safe to say walking was no longer a relaxing thing as we were constantly on watch for dogs/people/issues but we were able to do walks of .5mi or less. Miles learned to jump the fence when there were Deer in the sideyard ( ) so we had to put him on a run, so he no longer gets energy out in the backayard easily unless we're out there and constantly supervising.
During this time we started running into issues with our other dog Toby. Anytime the trainers came to our home we had to lock Toby away as Miles started seeing Toby's presence around his treat givers as a threat and started lashing out at him. Toby needed to stay locked in a room for 15-20 minutes after a session to let Miles decompress or he would lash out on Toby sniffing around where treats were. Our trainer advised we would work on this as time moves on and with our great success of taking Miles out in the dead end, short walks down our street, people/friends in the home we decided to move to a local park that's not well trafficked. We got 2-3 session at the park, even though there were no/few people there were loud traffic sounds which I think were overwhelming. Miles always seemed on edge, he struggled to do things he used to like making good choices to look away from a fake dog setup 50-75yds away. On one occasion a father and young girl were walking 25-30yds away and Miles locked on to them and shrieked/pulled, we redirected, treated, etc. This really worried my wife that we could never have kids in our home as he reacted to that child like he does dogs other than Toby.
It was at this point he started attacking Toby occasionally. They would be playing and wrestling and it would go too far and Miles would jump him and we would have to intervene and separate them. Miles would see a stimuli outside and make little whining noises. Toby would come to see what the fuss was about and Miles would jump him and lash out (seemingly barrier frustration?). It's now to the point that Toby is on edge around Miles. Regularly Miles will "block" Toby in an area and Toby's hackles go up, both dogs go stiff and we have to intervene and separate. This really bothered my wife and I as we don't want to see Toby harassed in his old age. We started having more tiffs over toys and food (not food in bowls, but hand fed food). We had to remove our toy box and we had to implement a hard no dogs in the kitchen rule, as well as no special snacks treats after Miles lashed out and flipped Toby on his back over being in the kitchen while we were cooking. This has helped and really cut down on the spats, they hang out on the couch together and still play occasionally but Toby is still on edge quite a bit and we still have moments where Miles "blocks" Toby in and they both go stiff. Prior to this we had good luck with leaving Miles out of his crate while we left the house for short trips like the grocery store etc. But at the advice of our trainers we go back to crating as a spat between Miles and Toby while we're not home could be tragic and awful. Any play between them now elicits attention from my wife and I as we keep an eye for subtle signs it's going to turn.
We informed B that this was more important than working with Miles at the park etc as Miles has to get along with Toby and not harass him. At this point our K was coming off maternity leave and is the one who works with dog on dog aggression in the home. K's first visit to our home with B at her side did not go well. We got Miles in place and she got in the door, he ran over to K and was fine at first taking treats from her and then suddenly started jumping up trying to nip at her face and barking. We reconvened outside and speculated that maybe he saw her as a threat to his resource B and her treat pouch. We were about to go out of town for the holidays so Miles had to go to the kennel as Toby went to my parent's house (they have a dog and cats, so Miles can't go there). Our trainers know the kennel owner well and arranged to visit Miles twice while we were out of town to try and introduce K on neutral territory. The first meeting went good, apparently Miles turned away and walked away from K, they took that as his way of saying no, this is too much and ended the session there. The second time, days later, Miles was taking treats from K and offering sits, and downs, and then suddenly changed his mind and started hard staring, barking, lunging from what I was told by the kennel owner. It is worth noting though that prior to his going to the Kennel we were weaning him off amitriptyline so we could get him on gabapentin.
Miles has been on gaba for 4-5 days now and we have seen no change, in fact he seems more hyperactive and has been having bladder accidents in the house again. We have a zoom meeting with B and K on Friday to discuss what happened at the Kennel and next steps.
For at least 2-3 months now my wife has been saying she's done and can't do this anymore with him. But at night when Miles is tired he loves to cuddle on her and she loves on him and forgets his crazy, and she swears it's like an abusive relationship. My wife is beyond over working with him and is ready to re-home him or take him back to the shelter as she is beyond stressed and exhausted. I just can't. The shelter is a kill shelter and he would not present well and I truly feel like it would be a death sentence. Rehoming seems impossible as he would need an exact situation of a single female who has no kids and doesn't regularly have people/kids over, no other pets.
Our vet, our trainers, our family have all told us we have done so much more than most people would and that no one would fault us if we had to throw in the towel. But I feel like I made a commitment to this little guy, but it's also driving a wedge between my wife and I. I would be heartbroken but I could hand him to a good home in the right situation, but I refuse to take him to the shelter, but my wife keeps saying that's the only realistic option and "what are we supposed to do just keep going through forever hoping for the right home to turn up?". I'm still hopeful I can find the right med to work with him. Can anyone offer any support/advice? Any other meds I can try that you've had good luck with? I'm looking for a hail mary.
Edit: Completely forgot to add that we had worked on muzzle training previously but we slacked off when changing directions to focus on other behaviors. We can still get a muzzle on him and he wears it when he goes to the vet. Last vet trip wasn't great, we always call to tell them we're there so they can clear the lobby and ensure no other dogs are present. We made it back to the scales and a vet tech didn't get the memo and brought another dog into the hallway, albeit hidden by a wall. But the sound of the dogs nails on the tile set Miles off into screaming and shrieking. We couldn't get him back down to earth, they couldn't get his weight and I ended up having to carry him to the exam room as he was actively trying to go find that dog. During the exam he seemingly calmed down, but the vet was just palpating his stomach and he changed his mind and started barking and lunging to the point the vet was visibly shaken and keeping well away. They couldn't get any bloodwork done on him due to this. We were luckily able to get him his rabies same DTAP because they sprayed cheese whiz on the floor and we distracted him.
Edit/Update: I have read all of your responses and considered them all. I was going to respond to each one addressing things each of you pointed out but it would appear I cannot. We had a zoom call with our trainers to discuss how things happened at the kennel when they visited Miles last to try and introduce K. They told us that K had been working with Miles for 10+ minutes asking for sit and other commands and offering treats which he was doing and happily taking. Both of them are experienced behaviorists and both said they never say dog attacks are out of the blue, there are always signs and body language. But both said after 10+ minutes of working, without any provocation or forwarding Miles changed his mind and lunged up at K's face and neck. Luckily B had the leash and luckily K was wearing a thick scarf that he got instead of her skin. They explained that they've both been in these situations before and they absolutely do not recommend rehoming him. They danced around it a little, but ultimately behavioral euthanasia was discussed. They both expressed that they love Miles and don't take this lightly but his unpredictability makes him dangerous. They explained that since my wife and I are trying to conceive it's extremely difficult to think Miles could ever be in a home safely with a newborn or any child. There is/was the possibility of an expensive specialist behaviorist vet but there is zero guarantee. As much as I hate to say it, we are very much considering BE.