Puppy Daycare Suspension

[honestsisterinchrist]

Today we picked up our 7 month old female Lab/Husky from daycare. While we were waiting for the staff to bring her up front, the receptionist informed us that after speaking with the staff and manager, that we should take a 90 day pause from daycare with them.

They had previously mentioned before that she has a huge amount of energy when there, and that she seems to ignore other dogs signals that they're not interested in playing; sometimes to where the other dogs begin to growl. There have not been any fights, and she has not injured any staff or other dogs. In there words, "she just goes from 0 to 90". After they mention this they always conclude with "but she's still just a puppy and this is normal puppy behavior".

They have suggested getting her some training, which we have been doing since she was 4 months old. She is in her third level of manners class, having past the first two courses, and working towards her Canine Good Citizen test. The daycare has suggested working with her to correct how she acts around the other dogs, but we simply never observe this type of behavior from her.

Whenever we go to the dog park she gets super excited and wants to go and meet all of the other dogs. However, whenever she approaches a dog that isn't interested in playing, she goes and greets them and then walks away to go find one that will want doing some chasing (her favorite game is to be chased, second is to be the chaser, and last is keep away). Usually after about an hour at the park she just kinds of trots around. So we haven't been able to do any sort of interrupt and redirect work. And at home the worst thing she does now is wander around the house when she's bored. She isn't destructive, rarely barks, and listens to most commands.

There are lots of options around us, so we will be trying somewhere else, but is there anything training-wise we can do? She is a very social pup and wants to meet everyone, but we don't ever witness her doing these sorts of things around other dogs or at the dog park. We're concerned that if we just stop taking her to daycare that she'll never learn social cues and just get worse. Is this something she'll eventually outgrow, and taking a pause will work? Are there any exercises we can work on at home that will help her behave better at daycare?

 

[camy934]

@honestsisterinchrist Does the daycare do mid-day naps? Mine recently implemented mandatory nap times and I've had my private sitter enforce naps as well. Manners can definitely go out the window after hours and hours of non-stop playtime and being overtired. You can work on relaxation training and keep her exercised, but your daycare has a point. She's an adolescent of two exuberant breeds and that may not be compatible with a daycare playgroup environment right now. Alternatively, you can look for a facility that offers mid-day nap times or just do daycare without playgroup.

 

[honestsisterinchrist]

@camy934 Yeah, they offer half days, which they switched her over to after I said we were still doing enforced naps. However, it doesn't sound like she was napping much when isolated away from the play.

 

[katherines12]

@camy934 Yup. I only recommend daycares that do enforced naptime to my clients. I don't personally need to bring my pups to daycare (they can go to work with me), but if I did, I would also only use ones that have naptime.

 

[shane260]

@honestsisterinchrist Just wanted to chime in that our 1 year old puppy is the same way about not getting cues (growling) that another dog doesn’t want to play. Our trainer said it common in adolescent (7 mo - 2 year) old dogs. She said basically they are still learning their social cues. Can’t offer any help as our puppy has giardia so cannot go to daycare or really socialize right now. But might be something they grow out of?

 

[uchinamuku2000]

@shane260 Our 10 month old is the same as well, you’re not alone! We can’t practice socialization either at this point because he’s not neutered yet, and neutered dogs seem to hate that he’s intact. Huge bummer, but not much we can do until our vet agrees that he’s old enough.

 

[jesussavessalvation]

@uchinamuku2000 What?? 10 months is not too young to be neutered. As far as I know, six to eight months old is common for dogs to get neutered/spayed (ASPCA website). Unless you have a larger dog?

 

[uchinamuku2000]

@jesussavessalvation He’s a Golden Retriever, and the new recommendations for that breed are to wait at least one year. Preferably two years. I called around to see if any vets in our area would do it at 10mo since we’ve had some close calls with neutered dogs being extremely aggressive towards him, but not a single one would.

 

[pellebroekveld]

@uchinamuku2000 Wow. I would wait too but my daycare wont take my pup after 6 months if they're not fixed. But I definitely dont see a super negative side to fixing 6 months and up.

 

[jingle03]

@pellebroekveld It has to do with their joints. 6 months would probably be fine for a small dog, but for large dogs, and especially breeds with known hip and joint issues like goldens, it's considered a bit risky to neuter them before a year.

 

[mauricio512]

@jesussavessalvation You should wait until they’re done growing. My dogs didn’t stop growing until ~2 years or so. Even small dogs grow until a year.

 

[shane260]

@jesussavessalvation Actually our vet recommended waiting as close to one year as possible for our 14 lb Westie. The hormones that are present in intact dogs are hugely beneficial to their growth and bones. We ended up neutering him around 8 months because of behavior issues (humping), but we tried! Other vets have said the same thing regarding age and I think they recommend waiting even longer for larger dogs.

 

[antonhrrs]

@shane260 That's good to know. I'm surprised because I know most shelters alter their dogs before placement. Is that keeping them in shelters longer or do you just promise to have it done when appropriate?

 

[kayperez]

@antonhrrs As far as I know, shelters do that to prevent more accidental litters. The benefits (lower population of unwanted dogs) outweigh the risks (one individual not having potentially IDEAL growth - but otherwise still being able to live a happy healthy life) of fixing shelter dogs before a year.

 

[shane260]

@uchinamuku2000 Glad we aren’t alone!! Our dog is neutered and now has a huge issue with our neighbors intact dog, which I didn’t even know was a thing until now. Sorry about other dogs being a jerk to your dog!!

 

[withby]

@uchinamuku2000 You can practice socialisation, In that real socialisation is learning to ignore distractions and be comfortable around them. Playing with other dogs is one thing, being able to take your dog anywhere and have them be ok and calm is another thing. Get your dog out to places and just hang out with him. Play with him, treat him for being with you. Reward him for being calm and relaxing more than you reward him for being exuberant. Go to as many different places as you can. I don't understand where you came up with the idea that you cannot socialise because they are not desexed. Show dogs are not neutered until they are years old and they hang out with lots of dogs all the time, they are taught to ignore others.

 

[uchinamuku2000]

@withby I guess I should have clarified, I can’t socialize him directly with other male dogs in a play date/daycare/dog park type situations. He is constantly out and about with us between parks with my kids and outdoor restaurants in our area, this dog is not lacking in basic interaction opportunities. He just loves other dogs SO much and desperately wants to play directly with them, and most of them are just not having it.

 

[ronv]

@honestsisterinchrist This happened to my puppy (well, he’s 1.5 now). I was devastated but I started to look at it as a blessing. My pup is very well socialized, he goes to the park about 3-4x a week, we walk 2-4 miles a day, he is exposed to a lot of different people and things. So I started looking around at other daycares and we found one that is an amazing fit for him. They have multiple play areas set up so if a few dogs are being extra wild and crazy they can move the quiet dogs to a different area. They enforce naps when dogs need it, they let you bring in a blanket and chew toy for quiet time. It has been so great.

My advice is to take a short break from daycare and then search for one that will meet your pups needs better.

Sorry this happened. I felt really sad and shamed by the entire experience.

 

[zionskid]

@honestsisterinchrist Your dog sounds a lot like mine when he was a puppy. He would go from 0-100 real quick and was bad at picking up when other dogs didn’t want to play with him. Things would escalate to the point of getting in scraps, but there were never any all-out fights. His favorite games are also chasing and keep away. I agree this is normal behavior for a high-energy puppy. They’re obnoxious just like little kids are obnoxious. They’re still learning social boundaries.

The good news is that he’s grown out of it. He actually now ignores dogs that are wild or too barky; I didn’t even teach him that, he’s just learned what he likes and doesn’t like. He does still love chase and keep away!

How is her recall? A big thing that was helpful for me was being able to call my dog away from playing when I could tell he was getting really riled up. This prevented him from spilling over into “way over excited” levels. I started by bringing super yummy treats to the dog park (hotdogs) and any time he came to say hello to me, I would give him a piece. (He’s a hunting breed so he instinctively runs up ahead then circles back to check in.) Then if he was standing or walking near me, not paying me any mind but not actively playing with another dog, I would call him over and give him a piece. Eventually we progressed to where I can call him back while he’s actively playing with another dog. He isn’t great at it and I wouldn’t trust him to suddenly back off if things were teetering towards a fight, but it’s much better than where we started.

Please be aware that bringing food/treats to a dog park carries with it a high level of risk, and be prepared to leave immediately if the situation becomes unsafe or you feel uncomfortable. I did have a HUUUGE mastiff realize I had treats and start following me around, but he was a giant teddy bear. Not all dogs are so gentle.

 

[honestsisterinchrist]

@zionskid Her recall is ok, but is still at the top of the needs improvement list. She’s great indoors, about 90% successful with just her name and no treat, about 80% in the backyard with “come” and high value treat, about 75% long lead training with a high value treat, but maybe 20% at places like the dog park. She’ll perk up and recognize she’s been called, but won’t actually return. Her current training class is all about working on what she learned in the first two and adding distractions. So hopefully we’ll gain some good strategies for improving that. A big goal for me is to have her pass her canine good citizen exam and then really start focusing on off leash training.